Low-maintenance & No-clog Gutters Comparison Page

Updated 4 / 8 / 2009

Note: Dixie Gutter Guard ® (out of business 11-05), K-Guard ®, Gutter Helmet ®, LeafFilter ™, Gutter Filter ®, The Gutter Brush ®, Gutter Love It! ®, Brookstone and Leaf Guard ® are registered trademarks.  I have no connection to these companies or their franchises.   Keep in mind that even though I try to be as unbiased and accurate here as possible, these are only our personal observations and conclusions I am sharing here.

I have been in contact with National Leaf Guard ® head office and their legal department for approval of this web page and it's accuracy since early 2003.  You can click on their names above to link to their official web sites to hear their side of the story as well. 

Also on our Site Map page I link to 40 different competitor's company web sites who all claim to have the best clog free gutter system on the planet.  I am that confident about what I have to offer.

 Why should we spend the extra money for clog-free gutters you ask? 

Assuming this is an issue for you, and these low-maintenance products truly work as they claim, these are some of the reasons to invest in some alternative to standard gutters:

1. The hassle and dread you save from the time and energy to do-it-yourself, or to find someone you can trust to access your roof and clean them out for you.

2. There is obviously the money saved from the regular servicing required, ie: labor or the cost of ladders, gloves, bucket, disposal of the stinky debris.

3. The best reason is the risk of a serious injury to you or the person you hire could suffer from a fall or some other injury.  No one wants to be climbing near the power line to your house.

4. Less scratches and dents on the gutters from leaning (or banging) ladders against them thousands of time over the life of the gutters.

5. Unless your roof is too steep, it is easier and quicker to clean the gutters from on the roof with less damage to the gutters, but there is the cost of  premature roofing wear from all the extra traffic on your roof to access your gutters that could cost more than the most expensive gutter protection products.  The less traffic on your roof the better.

The High Costs of No-clog Gutters:

I do not believe this should be so expensive, but most of these options are horribly expensive. Often more than new gutters and downspouts combined.  Even if they worked as well as they claim, I feel that cost and function needs to be more reasonable. Most of these options are not only expensive, but even more expensive than my charge for copper gutters installed with stainless steel screws. What is even more important is what is under you gutters. Leaf Guard ® hinges their warranty on the use of larger 3" x 4" industrial size downspouts. Not the hoods over the gutters, since those hood systems don't even work. They may do a good job of keeping the leaves out of the gutter, but the small opening slit jams with debris and will not let water pass into the gutter, so you have a waterfall instead. In that case you might as well have no gutters installed and save several thousands of dollars.

There is no perfect system out there, but I have developed a good system that is also a lot more cost efficient, and looks more conventional. More importantly it is more user friendly.  I can show you how I offer a lower price, better parts, and higher quality installation than any other gutter contractor in the area.  The cost of a DMR Gutters low maintenance package along with a full gutter replacement is still well below the cost of a Leaf Guard ® installation.  My bids have been around half their cost.  Still less even when adding the cost of other needed services like drip edge, new fascia boards, painting, and leaf-catchers.

One reason is I do not have a huge overhead or pay for the expensive advertising they need to use to reach enough Marks in order to stay busy.  Also, my gutters do not need to be replaced if they were to clog; with the simple access of the hinged leaf screens I use. I demonstrate how I really can afford to manage my No-clog warranty this way.  Most importantly is the fact that if for some reason either company were not able or willing to uphold their warranty decades later; with our gutter system you will be able to easily rectify the problem!

The No-clog Type Gutter Comparison To Similar Companies

Beware:
They will lay claim that their gutter system will never clog over and over again, but the problem is how they cannot guarantee that their gutter system will continue to accept rain water!  There in lies the proof that these gutter systems simply will not work. It is not a new concept as they would have you think. It was first patented in 1908. There is a good reason it never caught on.

I have some respect for Dixie Gutter Guard ® for their improved design and professional approach to marketing, but they were never here on the West Coast and went out of business several years ago. K-Guard ® has a better system than Leaf Guard ®, but they are not in our area as well, so Leaf Guard ® is the company I make most of the references to on this web page. They do have a clever design concept that easily swindles many clients willing to pay a small fortune for just aluminum gutters.  I do agree that they will work well for a good long time in a debris free environment, but in that case you have no need for leaf protection.

Most other web site who counter their effectiveness report that those gutters will still fill with debris.  But my contention is about all the debris that does not go into the gutter and gets stuck in the narrow channel for the water to enter.  You may not end up with an over flowing gutter, but instead you will have a nice decorative and soothing water fall on the edge of your roof line in spots where that debris gets stuck. You might as well not have gutters on your house at all.

There are dozens of other companies out there who also sell a similar type of sheet metal or plastic hoods to go over your existing gutters, and I link to many of them above and on our Site Map web page, but although they do perhaps leave the gutter more accessible for cleaning (unlike Leaf Guard ® gutters) I would say that they still have inherent problems that are quick to fail.  With some of these gutter hoods it is necessary to reposition the gutter a few inches lower (if possible) to get it to work right.  After all that work and cost, you might as well have bought all new gutters anyway and in most cases will have to, since gutter removal will damage most gutters beyond repair.

As opposed to what is over the gutter, I find that use of a level when installing gutters; making sure they have a slight grade towards the drainage outlet to be much more important.   Also to install a larger outlet opening is far more effective. Very important details that most gutter contractors choose to ignore.  I also feel that the cost should not be so unreasonable.  I found a strong hinged screen cover that has 4 simple to install clips to hold it in place, which also act as the hinge; allowing easy access when needed.  You can also see into the gutter to detect if there is a problem.  These are far wiser and have a much smaller price tag.  There is no perfect solution to debris and the moss that will grow in a gutters, but that is why it is imperative that the gutters are easily accessible when needed. The smart thing to do is find the best balance between looks, function, durability, and cost. Factors that do not cohesively blend.

I may not offer an unrealistic life time warranty on my clog proof gutters like they do, but if it remains a good trouble free system for those those 10 years (when I am of retirement age), that is certainly all the proof you should need that it is the best system around.  It is not likely to cause you sudden trouble after that time expires. I have no need to work in planned obsolescence.  I suspect that these other companies have no intension to stick around to see how well their systems hold up.  It is a common numbers game trick companies play on unsuspecting clients, just like the extended warranties they so aggressively push on many home appliances.  They know all they need to do is change their name and contact info and the vanishing act is complete.

Quotes for our solid copper gutters with stainless steel screw attachment, matching copper leaf screens, and the large No-clog outlets have still come in at $1k less than some Leaf Guard ® quotes for their aluminum gutters as recent as late 2006 (no joke).

Bare copper sheet metal cost gutter contractors over 7 times more than the cost of painted aluminum, which is of coarse more expensive than painted steel. Even if a Leaf Guard ® gutter system was as good as mine; which would you rather have? Which would look better and give your house the better resale value? Most all Homebuyers know the value of copper.

Do Gutter Hoods Even Work?

Here is personal story I was involved in several years ago:

I had a client named Mr. Bronson, who ordered some covers for his gutters from the Brookstone catalog that use the same principle as Leaf Guard ®.  He had a steep roof on a two story house, so he had me install them.  Within one year he called me back to remove them and install the hinged leaf screens I recommended.  He reported that with the metal covers pine needles would get stuck in the small opening, where the water is to wick back in.  This blockage would encourage the water to pour off the end and caused a water fall over places like his doorway (no joke).

But What About Their Warranty?

(a) They may guarantee that the gutters will not clog, but that does not even suggest that the gutters will continue to accept the rain water. 
(b) These hood designs have also been known to be a prime spot for moss growth and bees nests, which will cause a blockage inside the gutters that will be very hard to clear out if not impossible.  Even if it is not written into the fine print, a salesperson fielding the call may try to get out of their responsibility; saying it is an abnormal obstruction that is not related to fallen debris issues, and most clients would not have a defense.  Primarily they play the numbers game, knowing how most clients will never bother to call them about a problem, and simply suffer their loss to pay to have those expensive gutters that failed replaced with something different.
(c) Even if you were to fight through the warranty process, those warranties will not allow for frustrated homeowners to choose the option to have the obstructed gutter replace with a standard type of gutter, let alone with a different type of no-clog gutter.  They are stuck with the same system.

New Idea?

What didn’t work in 1908 doesn’t work today: K-Guard ® (Knudson Roll Forming) promotes itself as the pioneer in no-clog gutters.  But that title actually belonged to Mr. George Cassens who  had patented the two-piece reverse-curved gutter system in 1908. What Mr. Cassens designed may have been innovative in 1908 on paper, but his design was just as ineffective as today’s imitations and did not catch on back then either.

Note: info and diagram credit goes to Leaf Filter ™

Screens V. Hoods

Leaf Guard ® uses demonstration videos with shots of the galvanized steel hinged leaf screen that I had used several years ago (clever blokes).  Leaf Guard ® showed those hinged screens in their videos as a bad example of what people do to keep leaves and branches out of their gutters, showing them all bent up and dirty with debris.   But I had found a source for stronger hinged screens with a black powder bake finish and 3 clips/hinges per screen, instead of only 2 clips/hinges, shown.  These new screens are also 4' wide instead of only 3' wide.  I have seen their LeafGuard® gutters become very stricken with mildew within a few years and debris sticking out of the water entrance, but you will not see that in their videos.

These thicker screen material lessens the need for the arch needed for rigidity with the old screens I use to sell.  This heavier weight also helps the screen to be less prone to blow open in high winds.  The larger surface of area to permit the rain water to enter the gutters is at least ten times as much as any of the hoods can offer.  This means it is far less likely to become so saturated with debris that it will not permit water to drain into the gutter.  It is beneficial to have these screens up on top of the roofing shingles, so there is a slant downwards and the debris is much less likely to pile up on the screens.  It normally blows off in the wind after it dries out.

These screens will not keep all the pine needles out of course.  I do not try to make any claims that they will.  They will keep all the large debris out of the gutter, like leaves, pine cones, branches, and toys. <LOL>  Those are what will jam up a gutter fast.  That is the reason that they are clipped onto the outer lip of the gutter. The clips are also the hinge.  They simply flip closed and lay on top of the shingle. Without even opening them, you can easily see if there is any obstruction.  If you desire to clean them out, you can shove a cover over the leaf-catcher strainer, and then blast a garden hose water right through the screens to drive the debris and moss down the downspouts to dump on the ground.  Sweep it up and it is done.  With the warranty though, it is not necessary to even check the gutters for debris.  If the gutter gets clogged, it will over flow over the outlet, since I set that to be the low spot in the gutters.  If it does fail, it is my responsibility.  I will not how ever be doing periodic inspection for you. You will need to contact us for us know there is an issue that needs resolved.

Problem Issues with the LeafGuard ® and Similar Gutter Design

This photo was taken 12-04 of a local LeafGuard ®
installation in Lake Oswego, Oregon.

Note: I did get permission from the owner to take these photos, and did not do anything to alter this scene. Click on the photo to get a batter look. Keep in mind that even though I try to be unbiased and accurate here, this is only my our personal observations.  I have been in contact with National Leaf Guard ® head Office and their legal department for approval of this web page and it's accuracy since early 2003

(a) Aluminum Leaf Guard ® gutter systems are very expensive.  Note: our solid copper gutters & hinged leaf screens are about the same cost, are stronger, and will not mildew (as clearly seen in these photos) or leave any future painting issues.
(b) If your existing gutters are still OK, Leaf Guard ® offers no option to just add low-maintenance accessories to your existing gutters, helping to minimize the cost and waste of good functional gutters that will be destroyed when removed.
(c) Because of the closed design, the Leaf Guard ® gutters cannot be inspected or double caulked at the seamed corners and endcaps like I do. They cannot even make sure the caulk sealed just right by pressing the excess caulk into the seam with a finger.
(d) The corners are preformed. Most all professional gutter installers miter the corners at the job site, so there is only one seam to see and seal, and the only seam that could leak.
(e) One of the worst Leaf Guard ® problems that contributes to it's high cost: is that if the gutter does get clogged up, and they are not able to just remove the end-caps and blast out the blockage from one end to the other because of corners or length, then the whole gutter has to be replaced.  If for some reason you are not able to get the local franchise to honor their warranty, you are then stuck with a dysfunctional gutter.
(f) It is very difficult to even do a visual inspection to see if there is a debris or moss accumulation.
(g) Leaf Guard ® still seems to insist on using the large 3"x 4" downspouts all the way down the siding and then the reducer at the bottom to fit these industrial size downspouts into the common 3" underground drain sewer pipes.  Where it only took us a month or so to see that our clients did not respond well to seeing those industrial size downspouts on their siding.  I needed to still have the larger outlet in the bottom of the gutter, so I came up with a simple solution: see above.
(h) There is no warranty against clogging without these industrial size downspouts (as seen right) that are twice as large as standard downspouts, and unsightly.  Most any home-owner would love to see a gutter system that had no downspouts, if that were possible. The last thing they want to see is these huge downspouts mounted on their siding. Note: I noticed this issue early on and solved that problem.  Around 8 years later Leaf Guard ® has yet to follow our example and use the reducer up higher on the siding to reduce the downspout to a standard 2" x 3" size.  Since there is no functional advantage to a large vertical downspouts, it would seem the only reason could be so they can charge the their clients over $9 a foot for a $2 downspout.
(i) Leaf Guard ® sales staff do not seem to push the sale of leaf-catchers with their system, and the ones they do install are not nearly as good. This is because the sewer drains getting jammed up with debris does not affect their liability one way or the other, demonstrating their low sense of ethical responsibility.  Leaf-catchers are the strainers that go in the downspout for underground rain-drain pipe protection. A lot of small debris like the pine needles and the moss that will grow in the gutters will clog up the underground drain pipes.  It is very costly to have Roto-Rooter come out to un-jam these sewer pipes.
(j) Leaf Guard ® still use steel zip screws instead of aluminum rivets, since it is just a one shot process.
(k) It seems that they put more focus on the look of the gutter positioning to the roof than functional, installing the gutter straight with the roof edge, instead of using a level and assure that it will be more functional and not suffer standing water in the gutter.  The lower half of the gutter that hold the water and the little debris that gets through is not as deep as other gutters, so if the house is not perfectly level or perhaps settles in the wrong direction and 1" of debris settlement will cause the rain water to not make it to the downspout at all, and dump over the lip of the gutter.  But this is still not a warranty issue, as the gutter is not technically clogged.
(l) The huge 90 degree inside corner piece is still ineffective at handling the water flow rushing down from the valleys in a heavy shower.  Also, I have not seen where they have a way to do odd angled corners beyond a 90 degree inside or outside corner.
(m)  gutters are made with a 20% thicker than standard aluminum sheet metal to form these gutters, only because their design has no support to hold the weight of the water in the gutter other than a 90 degree bend of that soft aluminum sheet metal. This is the only gutter design that I have ever seen that has no support.  If Mt. St. Helens erupts again, like back in 1981, the weight of the ash fall-out washed down off the roof and into the gutters will destroy pretty much all these Leaf Guard® gutters, and I doubt their warranty will cover that sort of damage.  Even if it did cover that damage, it would definitely put the local franchise out of business before they replaced many of their damaged gutters.
(n) Leaf Guard ® gutters look pretty strange on houses, which is one of their hardest sales difficulties.
(o) The Leaf Guard ® gutter w/built in hood design will still trap debris in the small opening, causing a waterfall over the edge, and their warranty does not cover this issue.  It is still the home owner's responsibility to some how clean this out, as seen below with the large maple leafs sticking out.
(p) These hood designs have also been known to be a prime spot for bees nests, which will eventually cause a blockage inside the gutter.  Even if it is not written into the fine print, a salesperson fielding the call may try to get out of their responsibility; saying it is an abnormal or unnatural obstruction, which most clients would buy into.  They bank on the fact that most clients will never bother to call them about these problem, assuming this abnormal obstruction is not their responsibility, and simply suffer their loss to pay to have those expensive gutters replaced with something different.
(q) Those warranties will not allow for frustrated homeowners to choose the option to have the obstructed gutter replace with a standard type of gutter, let alone with a different type of no-clog gutter.  They are stuck.
(r) It seems LeafGuard Northwest (the local franchise), has allowed their reputation to fall from poor workmanship and refusing to deal with their client's complaints; putting themselves in the Angie's List Penalty Box! Some of the positive reports seem fishy with compliments and ratings too good to be true when other clients had rated them so low.

This photo was taken 12-04 of a local Leaf Guard ® installation in Lake Oswego, Oregon showing large leafs stuck in the gutter and caked with gross mildew stains.
Note: I did not do anything to alter this scene.
The Lady of the house did report she was happy with their decision to get these gutters, but it had not been very long yet.

Gutter Glove® Gutter Grate® Leaf Filter® Leaf Solution® Swistun® InvisiGuard®

Leaf Filter® and several other variation of that type of Gutter Cover?

There are several brands of these sort of fine mesh stainless steel screens over some sort of support frame, as listed to the right. They vary slightly, but do not work for long all the same. You would be wasting your money on this kind of gutter cover. It is very expensive, but even if it were 1/4th the cost it would still be a huge waste of money. In this case more cost does not mean better. I would not bother to install it on my house if some one gave me these covers for free. In fact I have been offered that deal and declined. I have also removed plenty of it from houses and just disposed of it. I would not feel right to give them away. This has been the worst example I have run across for leaf protection for gutters hands down and they have written so many loop-holes in their warranty that it is effectively useless. Example:

http://www.leafsolutionusa.com/product/elswarranty.pdf 

The main problem is the ridiculous fine mesh they use that is even a finer weave than a tea strainer (no joke). I have seen where window screen was used, which is far more course, but is still far to fine of a screen to work. The debris will cake over the surface of the screen before long and causes a waterfall situation over the outside of the gutter. These screens may be great at keeping any debris from settling in your gutters, but within a few years they will not even let water pass through as well. They become clogged with just a little mildew build-up or even dust and pollen. They also foster a very good breeding ground for thick clomps of moss under these screens inside the gutter, being so dark and damp inside.

Another problem you would encounter  is how this stainless steel mesh material is very thin and flexible like a stiff fabric, so they have to support it with a molded plastic or aluminum grid. The plastic will be destroyed by the UV rays of the Sun within a decade or so, just like with any vinyl gutters or siding. The ones that use aluminum for support would be destroyed by the stainless steel over time from a reaction called electrolysis. It is ill-advised to mix these 2 different types of metals.

Some of these scoundrels are so upset with me for disclosing this sham that they have threatened me with legal  action, but I have not been detoured. I could just as easily sell my clients on these screens as well. That is if I had no scruples. I am not a manufacturer of any gutter covers, so I have no motivation to discredit these sort of products, other than my desire to share the truth with those who would read these pages, where we clearly know what their motivations are. They will claim they have sold millions of feet of these screens and have had not a single complaint, yet those words are meaningless when spoken by a salesman, as we all well know from our own painful experiences in the past.

Besides basic logic I do have proof these simply will not work. I have some of this short lived screen material to show people off a client's house I had removed after only 2 years of service. He reported it had worked OK for the first year, until the warranty lapsed. Now that is an example of planned obsolescence of the worst kind. That set of gutter covers had cost this client more than my set of new aluminum gutters w/hinged screens. Would you say he got ripped off with this $2k loss? Here is our correspondence after I examined his gutter problem:

Our Response:

Greetings Tom,
It was nice to meet you and your wife tonight in formalizing the contract to work for you to replace your gutter system. Here is what I found this evening after you left:

First off; your roof was more littered with debris than I have hardly ever seen, let alone been up on. When I return to replace the gutters, would you like to hire us to clean off your roof? You can read about this sort of service on our web site at: http://dmr-gutters.com/pg/moss.htm

I managed to remove all the screens off the plastic grates they installed, aside from the one gutter over the garage gutter. I left that on in tact for a better time where I can get some good photos of this issue. And yes, they are simply screens. They could be aluminum, but I think they are stainless steel screens with such a tight weave mesh that it is no wonder they were not letting water pass. Our tea strainers do not have that tight of a weave (no joke). I left a sample section rolled up near the front door.

I brought a section inside our house to get a better look at it. It would not hardly pass water with all the mildew build-up on it. I used dish soap and hot water to scrub it vigorously and even scratched at it with my finger nails, but could not seem to clean it out. I finally slapped it as hard as I could on the edge of the sink a dozen or so times, getting more and more out of the weave. It mangled the screen working it so hard. I flattened it out and it now will pass water, but so slowly that more water runs over the sides than through it. Feel free to work over the sample I left there to verify this, if your so inclined.

In my experience even window screen has a far too tight a weave for use as a gutter screen for any practical use. This 'membrane' was insane. If they had used an actual pure copper mesh, it at least would not have mildewed so badly. But there is no excuse for the use of such a tight weave screen. I assume the roofer had used only their parts? It seems consistent with what they report on their web site.

The plastic grate under the screen has at least 100 times as much open area for water to pass through, yet will hold out the large debris for the time being until I can replace all your gutters. It will also clog over time. I was going to remove them as Ill, but it would require tools to remove the thin screws holding them on the aluminum brackets under them. It will certainly add a degree of difficulty to remove all the gutters when I will need to. I will most likely need to add a charge for that removal.

Those brackets are standard strength hidden hangers. The roofer was suppose to remove all the nail spikes and use the hidden hangers to remount the gutters, but he clearly did not follow the instructions and just put the hangers in the gutter loosely.

You do have cheap steel gutters, so no big loss there. You will soon have rust free aluminum gutters on your house with all stainless steel screws.

Need less to say, this will make for an interesting report on our web site.

No-clog Warranties:

I don't put much stock in warranties for several reasons:
(a) will the company under that same name still be in business after you have trouble?
(b) will they actually stand by their warranty, or was there some fine print that you did not happen to catch, that is their loop hole out of any actual liability.
(c) If a, b, and c did not stop you, how do you prove to the company the gutter is clogged?
(d) if you can prove it, do you then need to have the debris filter device removed and shipped back to the company for further proof and refund?
(e) lets say you do all this, will the refund be prorated against their no-clog warranty policy time limits? (20 year warranty - 10 years = 1/2 refund)
(f) Would that refund be higher than what you paid to compensate for inflation over the years?
(g) would that refund cover the cost of the original installation and then the removal and shipping costs?
(h) More importantly they are banking on the fact that most clients will you have the time and energy to deal with all that?

I have not found any clients who are willing to pay more for a gutter protection product than the gutter it's self, let alone something that will only last a short while and become a bio hazard. I trust you will see the logic here and agree. So who is buying these bogus products? Were they just victims of a slick high pressure sales program?

The DMR No-clog Gutter Advantages

(Note: Keep in mind that even if I work to be unbiased and accurate here, this is only are our personal observations.  I have been in contact with National Leaf Guard ® head Office and their legal department for approval of this web page and it's accuracy since early 2003)

1. Price $: for what these other No-clog Gutters cost, I could install solid copper gutters on your house (keeping in mind that copper costs about 5 times as much as painted aluminum and will not mildew).  

2. Better Gutter Sealant: I double caulk the seamed corners with a superior caulk. (because of the closed design, the Leaf Guard ® gutter has to be caulked on one end, slid together and hope it sealed. They cannot even make sure it seals by pressing the excess caulk into the seam with a finger. also leaving these caulk obstructions inside their gutters).

3. Better Construction: I do not use the amateur gutter part like preformed corners as they need to.  I miter all the corners into the gutter lengths, so there is only one seam to see, and only one seam to seal on each corner, to ever be a concern of a possible leak. I am also better able to custom fabricate the odd angles your house may have.

4. Future Cleanings: you are able to easily see and clear out any debris from our gutters (in case the company who installed the gutters were to go out of business, or you were to find out that they did not stand by their No-clog Warranty).

5. Holds More: a DMR gutter is deeper by 175% to the LeafGuard® gutter (2" to our 3.5"), allowing for a greater margin of error, like if your house were to settle.  That way there is less chance of it over-flowing when a small debris damn forms in the bottom of gutter, which is very common.

6. No Obstructions: a DMR gutter does not have any obstruction on the bottom of the gutter from front to back that would damn up debris, like the Leaf Guard ® gutters do.

7. Better Support: for the part of the gutter that holds the weight of the rain water and debris, DMR gutters have far more support than the Leaf Guard ® gutters.

8. Better Support for Ladder Pressure: a DMR gutter has better support against ladder pressure, when accessing the gutters or the roof.

9. I use a more expensive caulk, with M-34 Polycarbonate sealant technology (see Details web page for details and contact info).

10. Better Assembly: from what I have seen here locally, Leaf Guard ® and most other gutter contractors still use the quick and dirty steel zip screws, instead of aluminum rivets, like I have only used for the last 9 years.

11. Better Looks: I feel that a DMR gutter is a better look for houses (but that of course if highly subject to your personal taste).  Our gutter profile and smaller downspouts have less of the obvious appearance of having external plumbing mounted on the outside of your house.

12. More Practical: I use the 3"x 4" to 2"x 3" conversion funnel up high on the downspout, instead of near the ground.  This helps minimize the cost and has a better look

I understand how most any home-owner would like to see a gutter system that had no downspouts, if that were possible. The last thing they want to see is these huge industrial size downspouts going down their siding.  I realized in short order that it would lower the cost and look better to have the smaller 2"x 3" downspouts coming down their siding.  I have found there is no need for the large downspouts for the strait drop into the underground drain pipes.  It will not clog up.  I have not had any call-backs from clogged downspouts in the last 9 years of doing the downspouts this way since 1996.  If you are concerned with denting of the downspouts, thicker metal downspouts can be ordered through our local wholesale supplier. 

What about Copper Gutters?

Cost?
I refuse to sell steel gutters entirely, since they are not a good value when you factor in the cost of labor to install.  Surely not with the care and effort I put into our installations.  I do not push the sale of copper gutters over aluminum to benefit from our profit margin.  I would say that over 90% of our work in our first decade had been installing aluminum gutters, but for some reason I have been doing a lot more copper gutter work since late 2004.  It has been a good 3/4 our income since then.  Your cost for a copper system is a little over double the cost of aluminum, even though it costs us about 5 times as much to get the materials. Your cost is not so far different because there is not a lot more labor involved. Also, with copper there is an option to have a thicker stronger 20oz copper sheet metal used, instead of the standard 16oz copper. Aluminum does not have that sort of option.

The Brown aged Copper Look as the Trim Color?
There is this common thought amongst many home owners that white gutter will fit in with most any house paint combination.  I do not quite understand this logic, but I do see where the mildew that commonly forms on painted or plastic gutters seems to show up quite strongly on these white gutters.  Copper gutters will simply turn to a dark brown within a few months after installation, that tends to pretty universally fit in with most any paint job better, since most houses are painted some variation of earth tones to not stick out too much.  Copper takes several decades to tarnish to that chalky green color.  I have removed poorly installed copper gutters that must have been a good 40 to 50 years old, and they were still 90% just that dark brown, nearly black, with highlights of that green tarnish.  There are acid washes that can be done to accelerate the tarnished look, but the cost is hardly worth the few months wait to see them turn brown.

What about a New Bright Copper Look?
Most clients say they love the looks of aged copper, so this is rarely an issue.  Most people think of new copper having a more orange look, but that is only the pink of the copper with a slight tarnish beginning from the humidity in the air, to turn it more of that orange look.  I have only been hired one time to polish and add a clear coat to this copper scupper and downspouts before installation for a client in Salem Oregon, to retain that new pink copper look. 

This is ill advised, since any clear coat will deteriorate over time under the UV rays of the sun, causing cracking and pealing. Which will quickly tarnish the exposed copper metal in those areas.  It is very costly to have them regularly waxed, let alone to have them later stripped down, polished, and refinished.  It is best to leave the copper raw and exposed.  There is no treatment I have heard of to improve the life of the new look of copper.  Be sure to take some good photos of the installation right after I am done, to see your house both ways.

Advantages over Aluminum?
There is a clear advantage that aluminum and copper sheet metal gutters have over steel gutter, but the advantages copper has over aluminum is as follows:

1. With copper, you will never need to bother with a painting issue again. Since they are raw copper metal that will not rust, they are truly trouble free in that way.

2. Copper gutters will not form that filthy unattractive mildew on the outside face of the gutter you commonly see on any painted or plastic gutters.

3. The standard 16oz copper gutters are more rigid than aluminum gutters, so they are less prone to dent.

4. There is the option to have stronger 20oz copper gutters for even more strength at a minor added cost, where aluminum has only the one gauge thickness.

5. But the main reason clients decide to pay extra for a copper gutter system is for the brag points of having such expensive gutters and downspouts.

Our Copper Gutters:

Replacement Alternative

Another advantage of DMR is that I offer an option to upgrade your existing gutters to be much more trouble free, without having to completely replace your gutters.

Also, if you do not have a serious debris problem, I provide the option to have new gutters installed with our 27 advantages as listed on our Quality standards web page, costing less if you do not need our low maintenance options.  Even without our low maintenance package, our installations and warranty is still far better than any other gutter contractors in this Portland Oregon Metro area (see our Details page for more info).

Our Proof of Integrity

I know that sounds far fetched and egotistical of us to say I am so incredibly superior to our competition, but I do have proof of the high reputation I have worked hard to earn over the last decade of specializing in gutter replacement.  Beside my Integrity Award from the BBB (as shown here), the gutter supply wholesalers like 'Custom-bilt Metals' and 'Gutterman's Supply, Inc.' have reported that I am the only contractors in this Portland Oregon Metro area who consistently buy the better quality parts.  Custom-bilt Metals' phone number is: (503) 256-3328.  Gutterman's Supply phone number is: (503) 285-2500.  I also have better construction and design than Leaf Guard ®, and with a more believable warranty (see details below). 

Our standards are so high that I find that I have needed to order many of the parts from back East, like the hidden hangers, rivets, screws, and the end-caps I use.  The local suppliers will not stock them, since there is such a low demand by the other gutter contractors for stronger and better parts.  I alone do not have a large enough company to crash out the many jobs like other gutter contractors with crews of installers can, in order to make it worth the supplier's while to stock these better parts.  It is a terrible shame that I am so rare and one of a kind in this way.

I have had thought about franchising our name and system, but I have not found any other gutter contractors in the States who possess similar ethics as I do.  I do not see it as a possibility. That is a sad commentary of our modern world here in the States!  If you are such a person, read over our Training and Franchise web page for details.  Unlike the fantasy movie: The Highlander, there does not have to 'Be only One'. <LOL>

Below is a photo of our
Better Business Bureau's
NW Business Integrity Award
for the year 1998

I was also a 1997 finalist for this same award. See our referral web page to see how I managed to be honored with this special award